Since this is a wiki for Vocaloids, and there is a Fanloid Wikia, I think it would be best to move all of the derivatives over to the Derivative page, and with links to their respective fanloid pages.
They can have brief summaries and images on that page, but with a link to the Fanloid Wikia for their full article pages. If we did that, only the official Vocaloids would have main article pages, and some people wouldn't get confused.
They are fan mascots for VY1 and VY2 so stricly speaking they come under the "fan character" category hence would be dubbed as a "Fanloid" as they do not directly represent VY1/2 (Which would seperate them apart from, for example a fan-made Lola design).
Of course i'd be delighted to give them another term if you give me something other than "something else".
Well, they were made to represent VY1 and VY2, while derivatives are characters of their own, usually based on already existing Vocaloid. I don't know why you think they are any different than fanmade Lola design, the only difference there is, is that Roro and Kiku are semi-officially recognized by Yamaha.
So un-official/semi-official designs/avatars would be a more accurate term for them.
If you're going to pull up the "recognised by Yamaha" card then strictly speaking Neru, Haku and the like would all be "Semi-official Avatars" too as they're fanmade characters recognised by Crypton.
And I fail to see how Roro and Kiku don't match your description of derivative, because that's exactly what they are; characters based on VY1 and VY2 based on how the artists saw the product.
But of course, Haku, Neru and so on are officially recognized by Crypton, I even said two posts before. But they are not "avatars" for anyone. They are not supposed to be alternative Miku or anything like that, they are different characters altogether.
Roro and Kiku are not seperate characters 'based' on VY1 and VY2, because that would mean there was already a pre-existing design for each of them that someone could based their design for Roro and Kiku from. They were made precisely to represent VY1 and VY2. Not anyone else.
They can't be derivatives when there is nothing to derivate from. How can it be so hard see the difference between a fanmade character and fanmade design for an avatarless Vocaloid..
The wiki "doesn't work" without the odd few derivatives here. :-/
Its one of those "damned if you do, damned if you don't" moments where complete removal of a subject is impossible from the wikia.
Sooner later we have to cover them, even if in passing comment, they are part of the history of vocaloid in some sense. Even if its just to direct the reader to the proper place. :-/
Ditto its the same for Teto the UTAU, though we don't have a commitment for any other UTAU.
@Kimi : A fan character doesn't need to be derived from a character to be a fan character. though. There are plenty of other fandoms where they make a fan character based off the setting of their series and they don't need to be based off another character to fit in.
The definition of a fan(made) character is a character from a series which was created by a fan and not the original creator(s) of the series. To further emphasise; the definition of a "Fanloid" is a Vocaloid made by a fan (Fan Vocaloid). Roro and Kiku were not created by bPlats or Yamaha; they were created by their original artists whom are fans. Hence Roro and Kiku are fan characters.
>here are plenty of other fandoms where they make a fan character based off the setting of their series and they don't need to be based off another character to fit in.
That's called "OC"...Yeah, Neru and Haku are something like OC's too.
whatever, I guess I'm not going to be explaing for the third time that Roro and Kiku are not supposed be seperate characters but a designs for VY1 and VY2, official or not...it should be obvious.
I can place Roro and Kiku in the Related products category instead, that is where Teto is. I will not be creating extra categories for these two. I even use derivative on Fanloid wiki to indicate origin of where the fanmade character came from. So while Lola/Leon/Vy1/Vy2 are not personified officially, the fanmads that hold their name are derived. It is just easier to state "derivative of an existing character" on the Vocaloid wiki because it is more visually obvious when it comes to Crypton inspired creations.
If people really want this, then I can create a "Crypton derivatives" and "Bplats derivatives" page and place all the content on there with the infoboxes included. The song selections will have to become links and the marketing and trivia section will have to merge into the history section by expanding on it. Trying to make the page as 'stream line' as possible.
I seem to be the only one objecting to the idea.
But if its the majority vote I'm fine with it. Long story short, I've been ill all week and I'm not in the mood for big discussions. :-/
I just thought it would be best to leave the bulk of the information on the derivatives/fanloids/fanmades to the Fanloid Wiki, while we only cover basic information on them here (brief summaries, some images, etc). That way, we can let them shine on their own wiki, and there wouldn't be duplicate articles between the two wikis anymore.
@Bunai82 I like Trainspud's idea, so creating those pages would be great! ^_^ So, they would look something like the Characters section on the VOCALOID CHINA page?
Edit: Oops. This post wasn't supposed to be a direct reply to anyone.
@Angel I was only talking about their main article pages. I didn't mean to remove all information about them from this wiki. O_O
Hope you get better soon.
